Spain won the World Cup, and Andy Burnham will take over as Britain’s new prime minister today. More on that below. But first I want to tell you about my conversation with Zohran Mamdani, where we talked about football, Burnham and more.
It’s rare for American mayors to be household names outside the United States. But even for a New York City mayor, Mamdani has an unusually high global profile. Part of that is because of his international roots: He was born in Uganda to a family of prominent Indian immigrants. Part of that is his politics: His membership in the small but growing Democratic Socialists of America and his outspoken support for Palestinians have inspired progressives and alarmed conservatives around the world. And his viral videos have found an audience beyond New York.
I got a chance to sit down with him while I was in New York last week, and I asked him about the World Cup, taxing the rich and Benjamin Netanyahu’s upcoming visit to New York.
(Our conversation has been edited and condensed for clarity.)
Mamdani on Burnham, Netanyahu and the red card incident
One thing about America that’s unique is that it has all these diasporas. We saw that in the World Cup. Every team is a home team. Who were your favorite fans?
It’s true for the country; it’s especially true for New York City, a city of 8.5 million people where more than 3 million New Yorkers were born outside of this country, myself included. You just have to go to the right neighborhood to experience that. If you want to watch Egypt, you should go to Steinway Street in Astoria. If you want to watch Colombia, you can go to Jackson Heights.
I will give a special shout-out to the Norwegian fans, because it was the first time that Norway had been in a World Cup since ’98, and so we didn’t even have a sense of what Norwegian fan culture is. Wherever I was going I was seeing people rowing, and it was a testament to the way in which their run really swept up a lot of people. I’m an Arsenal fan. I’ve spent years both hating and fearing Erling Haaland, and this summer I fell in love with Erling.
President Trump called the president of FIFA and asked him to review a U.S. player’s suspension. Do you think it’s appropriate for a leader of a country to make that ask?
I’ll be honest with you, I think that so much of the coverage going into U.S.A. versus Belgium was about that red card being overturned. I thought it was a cruel red card at the time. And then all the lead-up to the game was simply about that phone call. And then the game itself left us heartbroken.
What I appreciated was seeing Flo Balogun go up to the Belgian coach at the end of the game because sometimes these players are made to feel as if they’re pawns in something much larger than themselves when in fact they should be center stage.
There’s something else I want to talk to you about. The center-left is struggling everywhere. Their voters feel let down, and some of them have swung to the right. Some of them have also swung further left, your voters included. Does your victory in New York translate overseas?
As much as we are New York exceptionalists, the struggle that New Yorkers are facing here is not a distinct one. It’s a struggle to afford rent, child care, groceries, public transportation. That’s a struggle working people are facing across the country and frankly across the world.
And for a long time, especially here, the idea that democratic socialists could have answers to these struggles and a vision that could go beyond recognizing them and actually resolving them was treated as if it was an intellectual premise. And what we’ve shown over the last six months is this is what it looks like if you operate with democratic socialist principles. You pay for more than 170,000 potholes. You put the city on a path to universal child care. You speed up the slowest buses in the country.
I think what people are looking for is a politics that is relevant to their day-to-day life, and too often it feels as if those on the center-left are simply explaining why things are this way, as opposed to answering how we can make them better.
What do you think about Andy Burnham?
I think it’s an exciting thing to see any mayor anywhere continue to lead. I am a little disappointed to hear that he’s an Everton fan, but it’s something I respect because when you hear of someone who’s a fan of a team that has struggled, you know that they’re truly committed to that team.
Ha! Do you think he represents the same left-wing politics that you represent?
I’m excited to see what his leadership looks like for people across the U.K.
A lot of people on the left are thinking about how to tax the wealthy without losing out on economic growth — because maybe there’s capital flight. You’ve just put in place a pied-à-terre tax. Did any millionaires call you, and how did those calls go?
I think whenever we talk about the importance of increasing taxes on the wealthiest in order for everyone to have a chance at affording life in the city, you will hear the idea of capital flight. And what we’ve seen time and again is a lot of the fear-mongering is not actually borne out.
I think, similarly, when we’re talking about a proposal to tax the secondary homes of nonresident New Yorkers that are worth more than five million dollars, it’s hard to find a New Yorker on the street who will tell you that’s a step too far.
Can I ask you something about the 250th anniversary of America? The ideals of the country are being contested right now. In fact it’s contested what it means to be American. What does it mean to you?
It’s a very American story to have been born in Uganda, come to the city at the age of seven, and now to be the mayor of that same city. It isn’t a story that could be told many places in the world. And what we see is that the story of this country will always be contested. However, the struggle to live up to its ideals, that is a constant. And it’s not an easy struggle, but it’s one that all of us have the responsibility to play for.
A lot of our readers know you as somebody who has criticized Israel and advocated for the rights of Palestinians. Are you going to divest New York City investments from Israel? Or arrest the Israeli prime minister when he’s in town for the U.N. General Assembly in September, as you’ve said you would?
I’ve been very clear that I believe that the age of a politics with exception is one that must come to an end. We’ve seen for years people espouse ideals they claim to be universal and then they’re willing to draw a line when it comes to the application of that to Palestinians.
We’re speaking about the World Cup. It’s a moment where the entire world is celebrating this tournament. And even in that moment, the genocide continues for Palestinians. Even in that moment we see news of the Israeli military killing an Egyptian man who was in Gaza helping set up watch parties for the World Cup. There’s no answer or justification for that. [Israel has denied it is committing genocide in Gaza. The man recently killed was Palestinian, working for an Egyptian aid group.]
And if that means being clear about the fact that, yes, Netanyahu deserves to be in The Hague, I continue to believe that. And that international law is not a suggestion, it’s something that we should all abide by.
I think we’re finding that not just around the world, but even around our city, our country, there are more and more people who say, I believe in human rights, and I believe it for all people and that includes Palestinians as well.
Spain defeats Argentina to win the World Cup
Spain scored in the second half of extra time to win the World Cup over Argentina.
Argentina, which did not take a shot on goal until late in the match and played down a man after a red card, fell short in its bid to become only the third nation to retain the World Cup. That will most likely end Lionel Messi’s World Cup career at the age of 39.
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